Legislature(2005 - 2006)BUTROVICH 205
04/27/2006 03:30 PM Senate RESOURCES
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HB57 | |
| HB419 | |
| HB307 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| += | HB 57 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | HB 307 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| += | HB 415 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| += | HB 419 | TELECONFERENCED | |
CSHB 307(RES)-KNIK RIVER PUBLIC USE AREA
CHAIR WAGONER announced HB 307 to be up for consideration.
BEN MULLIGAN, staff to Representative Bill Stoltze, explained
that HB 307, relating to the Knik River public use area, was
introduced last year. Since that time Representative Stoltze and
Senator Huggins have held two public meetings, many individual
discussions, and numerous meetings with the Department of
Natural Resources (DNR) Division of Mining, Land, and Water. As
a result new language has been incorporated to address the
various concerns.
4:06:27 PM
CHAIR WAGONER asked how many acres would be included in the
public use area.
MR. MULLIGAN replied approximately 262,000 acres.
CHAIR WAGONER said he understands it would be a multiple use
area.
MR. MULLIGAN said yes; the sponsor and Senator Huggins maintain
that everyone ought to be able to responsibly use the area.
4:07:07 PM
CHAIR WAGONER opened public testimony.
CARRIE GRAY-WOLFE, Knik River resident, said the area is plagued
with excessive target shooting, which is a threat to public
safety and destructive to the environment. Crime is on the rise
to the extent that armed troopers have been unable to control
unlawful activities. No sanitary facilities are available in an
area that is to accommodate a lot of people. This is a health
hazard and the bill doesn't provide funding to address this
need. This area is a critical migration route and nesting area
particularly for Trumpeter Swans. Enhancing motorized use is
contrary to the protection of this critical nesting habitat. A
couple thousand homes surround the Knik River area and the
residents will be greatly affected by activity in the valley.
MS. GRAY-WOLFE reported that the South Knik River Community
Council opposes HB 307 and she opposes it as well.
SCOTT WOLFE, Wildlife Biologist and South Knik River resident,
stated opposition to HB 307. However, because of the high volume
of wildlife and fish habitat that are in such close proximity to
Alaska's main population, he would support creation of a state
recreation area or game refuge.
MR. WOLFE said that Silver Salmon in Southcentral could be
further at risk if even more use is perpetuated and enhanced. He
suggested that the bill should specifically give the
commissioner the responsibility as well as the funding and
personnel to reach the objectives. Although the bill states that
nothing prohibits the Department of Fish and Game (ADF&G) from
engaging in habitat enhancement and rehabilitation projects, the
department is already stretched to the limit in terms of money
and personnel. The section on wetland protection doesn't allow
the commissioner to address the local concerns about excessive
target shooting and the use of explosives. The commissioner
should be able to restrict the type of weapons that are used,
the time of discharge, and the type of shot used in and adjacent
to wetland areas, he said.
MR. WOLFE reiterated he does not support creating a public use
area in a region that is so critical to wildlife.
SENATOR KIM ELTON asked if he would prefer a public use area to
nothing.
MR. WOLFE said he considers this to be nothing because the area
is already in public use. He's concerned that the legislation is
written such that one unarmed DNR person will be put in an area
where hundreds if not thousands of people will have guns.
BRITT LIVELY, Butte area resident, disagreed with the
introductory statement that extensive public testimony had been
taken throughout the summer and winter. The public hasn't had
its say and that isn't fair, she said. Spend just one Memorial
Day here and you'll understand why the bill needs stronger
language regarding law enforcement, sanitation, and habitat
management. Right now the moose are calving and the swans are
nesting and they are in peril.
Please give the commissioners of DNR, DEC and Public Safety the
assurance and funding to enable them to perform their primary
statutory duties and consider language for a Knik River Valley
state recreation area, she concluded.
CHAIR WAGONER commented that the statement about heavy use
during Memorial Day applies in almost any part of Alaska.
4:17:19 PM
GREGORY NELSON, Butte resident, related the historical uses in
the Knik River Valley and said that many of those recreational
activities are no longer compatible because of the damage they
cause. He related that in the last 25 years he has watched a
steady degradation in the wildlife and the kinds of activities
that people engage in. It's no longer comfortable or safe to
ride horses in some areas and the trails that were traditionally
used have been destroyed by ATV use.
MR. NELSON outlined that the bill is troublesome because it
precludes effective law enforcement in that it requires a single
unarmed person to deal with people that like to drink, drive
fast and carry weapons. Furthermore, the approach taken to
address the issue of grandfathering the trails was ridiculous.
What residents in the area want is a special recreation area
with all the attendant statutory protections. In closing he said
that area residents strongly support education and law
enforcement.
4:21:12 PM
KEN BARBER, Mat-Su LIO, said he traps and hunts in the Knik
River Valley. He supports motorized use in the area because it's
difficult to find places that are designated for motorized use.
This is a good place to have it, he concluded.
4:22:43 PM
PATTI BARBER, Butte area resident, said over the years it's
become more difficult to use a motorized vehicle in favored
recreation areas. She mentioned the Chugiak State Park, the
Homer Hay Flats, and the Hatcher Pass Recreation Area and noted
that the non-motorized public has not lost the right to use any
of those areas. That's why the Knik River Public Use Area should
be kept open for all forms of motorized vehicle use.
She suggested that the reports of burned and abandoned cars are
exaggerated because the ATV club conducts a clean up in the
spring and fall to eliminate the problem. It's time for Alaska
to follow in the steps of other states and develop a plan to set
aside areas for motorized use, she concluded.
4:24:24 PM
BILL FOLSOM, Mat-Su LIO, stated support for HB 307. We've been
losing access since I arrived in the '60s and right now we're
just trying to maintain an access area, he said.
PETER M. PROBASCO, Mat-Su LIO, thanked the sponsor and Senator
Huggins for what he described as a well-written bill, which
provides needed management and the authority for multiple use
without a lock up. He strongly supports passing the bill.
EUGENE KISSEE, Mat-Su LIO, said he has recreated in the Knik
River Valley for over 30 years and in that time he has seen many
areas closed to motorized traffic. He stated support for the
bill and said this is a place that people from Anchorage can
use. Regulations are needed for the indiscriminant use of
firearms, but that can be addressed.
4:27:02 PM
JEAN WOODS, Mat-Su LIO, stated support for HB 307 and noted that
the Butte Community Council voted 74 to 1 in favor of the bill.
She has used the area since 1954 and for age and health reasons
she can no longer access it on foot. There needs to be a place
for people like me to go to recreate and enjoy the outdoors and
this is a logical place for that, she said.
4:28:13 PM
JIM PELTIER, Mat-Su LIO, said he uses the area with a boat, a
four-wheeler, and a snow machine. He supports multiple use in
the area and therefore he supports HB 307.
RANDY OWENS, Knik River Valley resident, said he has enjoyed the
benefit of the area for many years and he believes that people
need recreational areas to go and ride ATVs. The area is largely
sand and gravel and that's where people ride. Problems with
garbage arise from time to time, but people are generally good
about keeping it clean. In conclusion he said this also gives
people in the military a place to ride.
PATRICK O'CONNOR, Mat-Su LIO, said he has spent most of his life
in this area and after 60 some years he accesses the area with a
four-wheeler. He stated full support for HB 307 because it costs
too much to travel to other parts of the state for similar
recreational opportunities.
JOE MELIN, Mat-Su LIO, said he uses a wheelchair and it's a lot
easier to get around the area in a four-wheeler. He'd like to
keep the area open to motorized vehicles and for that reason he
supports HB 307.
TOM DOMEIER, Mat-Su LIO, said he's used the area since 1974 for
hiking, canoeing, dog mushing, and four-wheeling and he supports
HB 307 wholeheartedly. He believes that the garbage issue ought
to be addressed and he would be happy to volunteer if patrols
are needed.
4:32:33 PM
VIRGINIA BLAINE, South Knik River resident, expressed concern
about what passage of HB 307 will mean to residents of the area.
She said that law enforcement and sanitary facilities are
desperately needed and there is a problem with indiscriminant
shooting and car burnings. Families would use the area if they
felt safe, but that isn't the case right now. She said she hopes
this beautiful area isn't ruined because legislators didn't
envision a better ending.
4:34:25 PM
CHAIR WAGONER asked if this designation wouldn't address some of
her concerns.
MS. BLAINE replied she doesn't read the bill that way. The area
is too large for one unarmed officer to patrol and neither
sanitary facilities nor the trash issue is addressed. She
clarified that she is not opposed to ATV or four-wheeler use.
GARY DORSEY, Knik River area resident, said all the complaints
he's heard are valid but he hasn't heard any talk about reducing
the use of ATV's altogether, just the wild use. He doesn't want
to give up using his ATV, but then he doesn't use it to run
through salmon streams or to endanger moose calving. Describing
the area as dangerous and a place he wouldn't take his family,
he said he carries a gun for protection against other people.
Noting that this is a beautiful area for all groups to use, he
asked legislators to use integrity and non-partisanship to
address the concerns.
4:37:27 PM
STANLEY CARTER, Mat-Su LIO, said this is a good bill and his
consensus is that 75 percent of the people want the area left
open.
4:38:18 PM
CHARLOTTE SARTOR, Knik River Valley area resident, said she has
been a non-motorized user since 1971. She said this a better
bill than the original, but she would suggest rewording the
section that addresses incompatible use to ensure that all
concerns are addressed. [Abbreviated testimony due to poor
audio] Good management is long overdue, she concluded.
4:40:37 PM
CECILY FRITZ, Chair, Knik River Watershed, said all use should
be compatible with the purposes in AS 41.23.180 to ensure the
protection of habitat and consider the interests of all user
groups. Area residents want to be involved in planning in the
adjoining high public use area. She suggested amending page 3,
line 13, to help alleviate the residents' fears.
CHAIR WAGONER told Ms. Fritz that he is aware that she contacted
his office to suggest the amendment and if Senator Huggins finds
it to be acceptable, he would probably discuss it with Senator
Lyda Green. As co-chair of the Finance Committee and a
representative from the area she may be able to accommodate your
wishes, he said.
4:42:02 PM
SENATOR ELTON said his understanding of the process is that
there is a public comment period and a public survey. Following
that, DNR will draft a plan and take it out for additional
public comment. He said it seems as though the concern addressed
in the amendment is addressed in the estimated two-year process
that DNR outlined. He asked her to comment.
MS. FRITZ responded the wording in the bill is a bit ambiguous
in terms of how much flexibility managers will have to address
the high use area and nothing in the bill ensures that residents
will be part of the planning effort. If the language were
improved there would probably be more support for the bill and
less opposition.
SENATOR ELTON commented that Mr. Mylius described the public
process to him and he has found that you can take Mr. Milieus'
word to the bank.
4:45:00 PM
LYNNE WOODS, Mat-Su Borough assembly member, said since the
beginning of her term on the assembly she has heard about land
use problems in this area. Residents want a management system
that will protect traditional uses such as hunting fishing and
mining and provide recreational opportunities. Residents want on
the ground enforcement to curb the unsafe shooting and aberrant
behaviors. Make sure the residents' concerns are met, she
concluded.
4:46:52 PM
ERIC UHDE, Public Lands Advocate, Alaska Center for the
Environment (ACE), informed the committee that ACE is a
grassroots conservation organization that works to protect
Alaska's recreational land. ACE is concerned about the Knik
River watershed and would argue that resource protection, safety
and the high quality of life on the Knik are not major concerns
of the Department of Natural Resources. He mentioned that the
lack of rules and laws are the result of zero enforcement.
Residents put up with gunfire, explosions, burned cars, and ATV
misuse.
ACE commends Representative Stoltze and Senator Huggins for
trying to address the problems on the Knik. However, ACE is
asking the committee to back the strong enforcement language
with a strong enforcement presence. Throughout the hearings the
issue of enforcement has not been disputed. Everyone believes
that the situation on the ground is out of control and the
problems in the area are too numerous and complex for one
unarmed natural resource specialist to tackle.
In conclusion Mr. Unde asked the committee to consider strong
enforcement and what it would add to the area in terms of peace
of mind for local residents and the stewardship of the resource.
4:50:43 PM
TODD CLARK, Alaska Outdoor Access Alliance, Palmer, said HB 307
provides a vehicle to develop a management plan to resolve the
problems that have been aired today. He suggested that a major
point of disagreement is whether the plan set forth in HB 307
would actually address the problems. The point he wants to make
is that the bill does get the people that are using the area
together to try and solve the problems. Mr. Clark also mentioned
a lack of opportunities elsewhere for motorized vehicle use and
the wonderful wildlife resources in the area. [Abbreviated
testimony due to poor audio.]
4:53:31 PM
CHAIR WAGONER closed the public hearing.
4:53:46 PM
SENATOR RALPH SEEKINS referenced the section on enforcement
authority under Section 41.23.210 and noted that under Title 16
for fish and game, any departmental employee that the
commissioner authorizes is considered to be a peace officer. He
asked if the same would apply here.
MR. MULLIGAN said that's correct. The sponsor specifically
reviewed the language from fish and game, but other departments
also utilize that language.
SENATOR SEEKINS asked for clarification that it is only for the
purpose of this chapter.
MR. MULLIGAN said yes.
SENATOR SEEKINS continued and said according to an attorney
general opinion for fish and game, the employee is not a peace
officer under AS 01.10.060 and they don't have general authority
to enforce all other state criminal law. He questioned whether
the intention is to restrict authority to the enforcement of
regulations.
MR. MULLIGAN said yes. The idea is that the DNR employee would
focus on enforcing regulations, but a peace officer as
determined by AS 01.10.060 could enforce the regulations as well
as the general enforcement duties.
SENATOR SEEKINS pointed out a third paragraph in the fish and
game language and asked why that fish and game model wasn't
followed.
MR. MULLIGAN deferred to Mr. Mylius.
DICK MYLIUS, Director, Division of Mining, Land and Water,
Department of Natural Resources (DNR) said quite honestly they
didn't consider that option.
SENATOR SEEKINS said since there is joint responsibility for
some of the management functions in the area, he would question
why DNR wouldn't want a department employee to also have police
powers for enforcing the requirements of this chapter.
MR. MYLIUS said under paragraph (1) it say that the commissioner
can delegate the authority to "an employee of the department or
other person authorized by the commissioner." He said that could
include DNR.
SENATOR SEEKINS agreed and said he was reasonably satisfied.
SENATOR CHARLIE HUGGINS said HB 307 places DNR as the lead
agency. The difficulty is that most people don't realize that
this legislation provides the framework. The bill doesn't
mention things such as sanitation because that's not how it
works. This is a stepped process. Certainly everyone would agree
that the status quo is not acceptable and having someone in
charge is a good thing. He said he would continue to work with
all interested parties.
5:00:49 PM
SENATOR ELTON said he was struck by all the talk about
enforcement. He paraphrased page 2, line 10, and noted that the
fiscal note talks about the DNR employee who would be in a
management position. He asked for clarification that DNR would
not be restricted from developing a plan that would call for
additional personnel - particularly enforcement personnel.
MR. MYLIUS said that's correct. The DNR fiscal note funds the
planning effort and then one full-time person dedicated to the
area. DNR realizes that one unarmed person cannot address some
of the issues in the area; they were just looking at DNR
staffing needs to start planning and get an on-the-ground
presence in the area. This gets the ball rolling and through the
planning process it identifies potential solutions, which could
involve additional enforcement.
5:02:43 PM
SENATOR SEEKINS moved to report CSHB 307(RES) from committee
with individual recommendations and attached fiscal note(s).
There being no objection, it was so ordered.
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